@desolutionist said in Humility + Decree of Justice:
Humility is also bad against oko, just generally which is a real concern in vintage I would think.
Just curious. Why is it bad against Oko? I thought creatures don’t really matter when Humility is in play? So if creatures don’t matter then what is Oko doing?
It seems to be the biggest drawback of Humility other than the mana cost is being Disenchanted or Force of Vigored.
Percistent effects and timing. Oko can make an army of 3/3s even with humility out.
@vaughnbros You mean the "enters the battlefield with X +1/+1 counters" on Ballista, Walker, etc? That's not an ETB trigger, they just come in with those counters.
The rules text regarding this was changed in 2017. Creatures that "enter the battlefield with" no longer gain the with.
Rules text for clarity:
614.12. Some replacement effects modify how a permanent enters the battlefield. (See rules 614.1c–d.) Such effects may come from the permanent itself if they affect only that permanent (as opposed to a general subset of permanents that includes it). They may also come from other sources. To determine which replacement effects apply and how they apply, check the characteristics of the permanent as it would exist on the battlefield, taking into account replacement effects that have already modified how it enters the battlefield (see rule 616.1), continuous effects from the permanent’s own static abilities that would apply to it once it’s on the battlefield, and continuous effects that already exist and would apply to the permanent.
Legacy elves doesn't play force of vigor or ouphe main decked because they don't answer half the meta... Apples and Oranges.
Likewise the banned cards in legacy can make elves even more insane here:
I don't think a vintage elf deck would look identical to a legacy elf deck.
For a value engine only deck such as BUG, I dont think this card is good. Any time you would want this in those shells, I think Veil of Summer is better. Providing uncounterability is strong, but it is just a 1/1 after that, veil is "hidden" in hand and cantrips.
Elves is the ideal shell because this card synergizes with most of the other cards in the deck (heirarch, birchlore, symbiote) and the haymakers that deck plays are extra vulnerable to countermagic (natural order).
Friends and I have been testing mono red gob list. Basically an aggro list with red blast and null rod for disruption.
Snoop is a great value engine, and theres minimal deckspace requirement to run a copy of kiki and mogg fanatic.
We do not run ringleader or matron, both engines are too slow for vintage we've determined.