@Winterstar said:
Is this the thread for the betting pool of what card the league campaigns for restriction this season?
Itll probably be dark petition, it seems likely that a bunch of vintage dilettantes will find a way to bitch and moan about it. Rich Shay and Steve Menendian are excluded from that statement.
I mean, I know the community here is eagerly awaiting g Sam Black's opinion of the format.
@Soly said:
My biggest issue with this format is that they view asthetics higher than gameplay.
I want to play a format like this; I don't want to buy old fetchlands/etc when I own new ones, just because of the asthetics of it.
Same issue I have with Old School.
A big part of the Old School experience, for me, is seeing all kinds of older cards that have been since outclassed, in all their original glory. I like that the format makes them playable again, and for me allowing all kinds of reprints just destroys 99% of the reason to play in the first place, which is to see these iconic cards in their original form. The art and overall aesthetics are the driving force of the format I think, way more than the game play itself (though this is a lot of fun too). Most tournaments feature alcohol; my experience has been that I don't particularly care about the outcomes of my games and matches so long as I get to spend an afternoon bullshitting with folks as passionate about the classic cards as me, and seeing sweet cards! 7th edition City of Brass is not sweet. Neither are Ravnica Birds, or the alternate artwork on Wrath of God, or any number of cards that they changed.
Seeing these reprint cards get played at events really just takes my experience down many notches, they destroy the feeling that you have jumped into a time machine. It's just so jarring. Issues with the aesthetic standards are the most common complaint/divergence in understanding that I see regarding these types of formats, maybe the above can help explain why these rules exist, and why I feel they are 100% necessary when talking about throwback formats. Another minor consideration is that a first print only policy makes it easier to at a glance determine if a card is legal or not.
At least in the US, Oldschool doesn't have to be backbreaking, since they allow Revised edition cards and also Fallen Empires, which can help fill out decks because of the pump knights and hymn.
They're not gonna stop until we're all playing decks with 20 creatures
The whole thing seems very simple to me. Misstep needs to be banned, because it is a trash card that results in the wholesale avoidance of the 1cmc slot and adds nothing. It is the ultimate circle jerk card and it wrecks diversity. Mentor needs to go as well, because it chokes out all of the other creature strategies. Other than that? No changes. People managed to beat shops when it had 4x trinisphere. People managed to beat shops when it had 4x chalice. I could see restricting ballista at some point in the future, but really that's it.
It's comical to me to hear people arguing that shops is warping the format. Shops is eminently beatable, there are a ton of hate cards that have applications in other matchup, and the deck just loses to itself far more often than mentor.
Imagine a scenario where you can only hit either mentor or shops. What do you think the format looks like if you keep mentor? It will look the same. The same decks that are ridiculously outclassed are still ridiculously outclassed. If you ditch mentor and keep shops as is, you might actually see some new things pop up. Hitting mentor and misstep would go a long way towards opening The format upbagain.
If my only T1 is revoker in the dark, Id have to think hard about even keeping it in the first place
Could we please refer to him as Joe Bogaard? We already have a Joe B and hes a world apart from the guy were talking about
My preference is to make them legal when they are legal in sanctioned play. I prefer to maintain as many links as possible to sanctioned play, and divergences in the card pool are a big enough break that I would not play in a tournament where they were allowed.
The other issue for me is that it can be awkward enough dealing with proxies of the obvious cards, let alone cards with unfamiliar art and walls of text.
@msg67183 said:
This is Nature's Claim 5-8 in Dredge's Sideboard. It hits Leyline of the Void and costs one mana, two things Abrupt Decay cannot do.
I probably wouldnt play this in dredge, Id rather run serenity and pay the extra mana. Current dredge board is:
4x Decay
4x Serenity
4x Ingot Chewer
3x Whispmare
I prefer the evoke guys to natures claim, they dont get misstepped and being able to trigger bridges is a great way to win through hate like priest or cage
This is like Magic racism haha.
Cletus: "You should see on the internet people upset about Lodestone Golem, tryina say that shops aint takin over the meta, them workshops is 18% of the format!"
Rufus: "Hell, you should hear em tryin to say that theres all different shops! That there aint just one workshop deck but a whole bunch 'o diffrent 'uns"
Cletus: "Aw hell, I can't tell em apart, all them workshop decks just look the same to me right? A deck that plays lodestone is a deck that plays lodestone, them shoppers tryina talk about diversity...theyre all the same in my book"
Rufus: "Only good shops is a restricted shops, what my pappy always said"
I surely will not be supporting the Vagina Super League anytime soon, this is the second time now that after some high profile bitching a marquis shops piece gets hit.
My favorite nonsense list to date was the guy who registered 59 Forests and one Lost in the Woods at GP New Jersey (Brainstorm mat). He insta dropped but I thought he should have run a few rounds since the deck has the chance to win vs creature based lists via decking/concession.
8 or 9 rounds for Vintage main event
If you play all the rounds out I would expect to finish between 8 and 930pm.
For a first timer, I would recommend talking with and meeting as many new people as possible!
@Prospero @iamfishman This is the best event of the year after NYSE and TMD open
@the_gremlin_lord Aesthetics are a big part of the format (hence the restrictions regarding artwork and borders), and for quite a few people the aesthetics and overall sweetness of the deck outweighs functionality. Photo decklists enhance this aspect.
@colbey81 by the time you factor in the gas and hassle of driving, the flight isn't all that much of a difference
I would recommend blanking a foil, either by using acetone to just take off the ink (blank shiny canvass) or peeling off the foil layer entirely (blank white canvass, my preference). Using thin sharpie markers you can then write on the text and approximate the art. I think this gives the clearest presentation, and even if you aren't amazing at art, the older iconic stuff you will be copying has simpler images that are so well known that even a passing resemblance should allow an opponent to clearly identify the card.
I think drain is way too much for legacy, but who knows
@poxeveryturn Ashes is a worse version of cage. Dredge is not an activated ability it's a replacement effect
@kingleovold Hitting shop itself is equivalent to hitting shop and sphere. I don't know how many taxing effects the deck can tolerate with only 1 workshop. Ravager is so heavily creature based that you could probably still run 4 thorns, but ancient tomb damage stacks up quick. White eldrazi may wind up being the better deck at that point
@brass-man somewhere between 0 and .00000001%
@chronatog Berserk and Show and Tell are not on the reserved list.
And while it is true that wizards doesnt manage the secondary market and are not generally responsible for the prices there, they could be liable for losses incurred through reprinting, because of the promise that they made.