Don't we still have to max spheres? I think the 4 SoR and 1 Thorn is probably the baseline now along with Tanglewires, the list that are just trying to race popcorn look like Hurkylls blow outs to me without beaing fast enough to really race Outcome decks. I don't think there is anything wrong with going small, but I think we still have to max out disruption.
Best posts made by defector
RE: Workshop Aggro
RE: How did you start playing Vintage?
I went from kitchen table to Vintage in the late 90's. I started buying packs at the end of Revised and was able to get into a decent amount of the staples for cheap. It took me just over a decade to get fully powered, I bought my first card, a Mox Jet in probably 98 or 99 and I got the last card, a Time Walk in 2012 or so.
RE: MTGO April 2016 Power 9 Challenge
I thought Gush was a fine choice in shops metagame because it could transform so well between a blue deck that won counter wars with FoW X4 MM X4 Fluster X2 MisD X2 that could then sideboard into Mountain plus 7 Red Artifact Destruction cards. The shops deck post Lodestone could still beat that deck in general until Treasure Cruise/DTT gave them a drawing answer to sphere effects, once those cards got restricted then Shops started to dominate to the point that the DCI felt Lodestone had to go. Now as we things evolve we'll see about the future of Gush. I think its hard to talk about Gush decks over the last two years or so because they have mainly been Treasure Cruise or Dig Through Time Decks, and those tempo shells I think beat Big Blue without much stress especially the aggro Treasure Cruise decks. in some of those deck in particular Gush was run as a two of to round out TC and DTT engines. Hopefully the shops players will find a redesign that gives them some real space in this meta, if not maybe gush has to go. We'll see, but with Vintage I don't take anything seriously until six months post restriction as we tend to move slowly and don't have a huge player base.
RE: Lodestone VS TKS
I think we'd find room for it in the 75,no arguing there, I may even side in an entire playset in some must just because I know my opponent is bringing in 7-8 pieces of hate for me. But the deck would still start with 4 LSG then worry about the Thought-Knots. Maybe 2 main 2 side? That would be pretty sick:)
RE: North American Eternal Weekend 2017 Metagame Breakdown
@oestrus Your not wrong. As a shops player I keep wondering when the blue players will just build the blue deck that beats shops, ie Oath or Landstill. They aren't hard to find. Maybe is MM was restricted we see this transformation? The blue decks seem kind of pushed into a weird space where outside of guys like Brian Kelley everyone is scared to play Oath and have a better shops mu. This Jan will be very interesting:)
On the bubble at Denton TX Vintage Proxy Tourney
Note I deleted this out of the Tournament Results tab and re-copied it in here, this seems to be the better home for reports:)
I looked at the four copies of Lodestone Golem and said, I'll keep the one that the tear drops fall on, and put him into my deck and shuffled up a Forgemaster list for this Denton unlimited proxy event.
We had 25 show and set up for a solid if not slightly squishy five rounder. We had some cats down from Oklahoma City, thanks for making the drive and we had a few others from out of town, thanks for finding the time. We plan on doing more and we're going to give streaming a shot at the next one.
First off the List:
Mishra's Workshop X4
Ancient Tomb X4
Mishra's Factory X4
City of Traitors X2
Tolarian Academy X1
Sphere of Resistance X4
Thorn of Amethyst X4
Chalice of the Void X1
Phyrexian Revoker X4
Kuldotha Forgemaster X4
Phyrexian Metamorph X3
Wurmcoil Engine X2
Steel Hellkite X2
Lodestone Golem X1 (soaked in tears from all the sad)
Sundering Titan X1
Round 1: I crush the BYE like a boss, honestly it never had a chance.
Round 2: Steel City Vault
I get the match in 2 but each game I am within one turn of death when I get a Hellkite out that destroys part of his board. I think even post restriction, we are a little slower, but still have too much disruption to fall behind in this mu.
Round 3: Gush Mentor
I lose in 3 having lost the critical game one to a flood. These guys still bring in a lot and the high curve commitments got me in trouble. If one of my Ancient Tombs is a City of Traitors in game three I may get there, I stabilize the board with a Wurmcoil at 4 life and he double blots me. Very close. I think Martello is just a lil ahead game one here and then behind games 2/3, if you can win game one and go first game 3 the MU still feels very close to even. My opponent goes on to top4 the event.
Round 4: Landstill
I lose in 3, this mu wasn't great before the restriction and seems only worse now. I got in some trouble with wastelands and a maindeck Stony Silence game 1, game 2 I get a decent lock going with crucible waste and resolve a Titan to solve some of the basics. Game3 I have a risky turn 1 Lodestone which I keep, my opponent mulls to six, but has the Force. I draw nothing and he gets an energy flux down and that's it. That may have been too greedy, not really sure how best to play this mu in the current meta, but I feel like Martello is behind here. My opponent here goes on to top 4 the event as well.
Round 5: Its a clean break for the top 8 so I play a meaningless round vs a nice dude from OKC on Omnitel, I get there in 2 and I improve to ninth.
Thoughts on the future of Shops:
I think Martello is a dead end in the current metagame and B/R environment. Lodestone and Metamorph really got you to Forgemaster and without them coming together nicely I just feel like Big Robots in legacy, sure you can overwhelm people, but you are super soft to waste effects and pass too many turns without playing anything. That being said, a 2-2 finish in matches played and taking both my losses to close 3 games tells me that shops will survive this cruel blow. Next up for me is experimenting with Ravager builds. If those suck we may have to look at some dedicated control shell, blow the dust of the smokestacks, put three tabs in the main for those annoying tokens and just grind like a student driver with a double clutch.
That's a fate I'm hoping we call avoid, long live Ravager:)
We'll the next event when it gets closer and we'd love to make Dallas the proxy vintage capital of the southwest:)