Documentation of rules violations/questionable behavior by the Eternal Weekend Winner

@diophan Though maybe this isn't the thread, I believe there was a pretty big disparity in enforcement between the singular brainstorm incident and the nonsense that went on with this guy, and that this disparity itself also merits discussion, even if it is somewhere else.

@ajfirecracker It all depends on how he sets up his cards. You can't possibly determine how his pile shuffle is going to end up without knowing the original position of his cards. If you practice enough doing it, you can memorize that say the 20th card in your deck originally will always end up the 1st card of your deck, and every other location of every card in your deck at the end.

@vaughnbros that's only if you end with a pile shuffle tho, right? I mean if I'm pile shuffling I never end with a pile shuffle - I do several side shuffles after that. I can't see how a person would know where a particular card was (I never play with foils or marked cards) after that.

@ChubbyRain Pile shuffling along with regular shuffling is fine. It doesn't have some effect on randomization in that case. When you only shuffle only parts of your deck regularly, and/or pile shuffle, your deck is not sufficiently randomized. The fact that they caught him for this error, not randomizing sufficiently, and didn't DQ him when he continued the same shuffling pattern is pretty egregious.

last edited by vaughnbros

@themonadnomad What constitutes a side shuffle?

@vaughnbros The difference is I can do a weave in under a minute, I can't do some sort of complicated thing where I place each individual card in the optimal spot without taking some serious time. If you wanted to cheat, you would choose a method that you can do quickly and easily (to reduce the odds of being caught)

@ajfirecracker Any weave is a systematic form of randomization therefore you always have some sort of idea of where they will end up if you have any idea of where they started.

@themonadnomad said:

@vaughnbros that's only if you end with a pile shuffle tho, right? I mean if I'm pile shuffling I never end with a pile shuffle - I do several side shuffles after that. I can't see how a person would know where a particular card was (I never play with foils or marked cards) after that.

This is where the bent foil cards come into play. When you pick up the deck you can feel the separation between 2 cards caused by the bending. You may not know if its a crucible or stripmine specifically, but you know its one of the cards you want to see and you can manipulate your shuffle from there.

@themonadnomad If combined with a pile shuffle, you are good. A mash shuffle doesn't really move any cards from the top of your deck to the bottom, or vice-versa.

Just so we are clear the problem with Joseph Bogaard's technique has almost nothing to do with pile vs riffle vs mash. It has everything to do with him shuffling extremely slowly, while constantly feeling his cards in between each shuffle.

@vaughnbros ok I am more making sure that I am covered really. i definitely do not shuffle slowly, I double sleeve and I never play with foils (I hate how they warp and you can't ever completely "foil out" a vintage deck).

"I'm not a big fan of two lands a turn" - Bob Maher

So. Great.

@darkquarterer said:

I honestly think this guy was just a lucky doofus. But maybe thats just me. I usually find that cheaters are usually better players.

I dont think Joe B plays much Magic. I heard his last Vintage tournament was in 2011.

last edited by Smmenen

@Smmenen It's entirely likely. The guy from the Shay camera match hadn't played sanctioned mtg since 1994 or so.

I don't know what to think about all this. I'm generally super nervous in round 1 of tournaments and do stupid things by accident. Sometimes it just gets worse and worse until I drop a round. I played dredge at Champs last year and screwed up in round 1 forgetting to discard two cards I dredged into an empty hand before going to my draw step, dredging a card and realizing I had a hand when I shouldn't. Then in round 2 my hands were shaking when I shuffled my opponents deck and I dropped a card on the floor.

That's 2 grvs in 2 rounds but it wasn't like I was cheating...I'm just an anxious person.

That said, this sounds bad and I trust that the community members who spoke out about this wouldn't have said something without reason.

Given that Strip Mine is cheap and we can all agree it shouldn't be 1 of 3 foils let alone a savage FTV foil why would you put it in your deck? Why subject yourself to scrutiny just to play a gross looking FTV foil? No player I know would ever construct their deck like that ever. Clearly he could bum a Strip Mine, Commander Sol Ring and tenth Crucible from Daniel Chang.

I had my own poor interactions with judging staff during the main event.

Game 1 round 1 judge tells me to take off my hat due to it being offensive, hat had 3 words on it no graphics saying "girls gone wild."
I didn't argue enough after appealing to find out whether or not I would get a dq for offensive behavior or whatever.

Game 3 round 2 , I catch my opponent blatantly cheating while resolving a dig through time, essentially he claimed that he cast it on my end step when it was the card he had drawn for his turn, which allowed him 2 turns in a row.

Head judge spent 20 minutes basically walking the kid through reconstructing his part of the game to determine card order etc. It was outside coaching as far as I was concerned, it got to the point where the player simply lied about having dig through time in his hand and got away without any warning at all.

From all the stories throughout the weekend, the judging was definitely inconsistent if not borderline abysmal in some spots.

@EmoPizza Hi I'm the brainstorm guy. It was an honest mistake unfortunately it wasn't caught while the game was still going on and video was watched after match. I rewatched the footage and it appears bad on camera. The head judge just spoke to me and waived my opponent away when he asked what was going on. The situation could have been handled better but there is know way of the judge knowing that I'm telling the truth. Maybe he rushed to a dq I had no prior warnings. I don't like making excuses and told him I got excited about moat and messed up. I said I disagree with his decsion to dq but respect his opinion if that is what he feels he needs to do.

My thoughts on Vintage events friend who was on staff said his main take away from this event was major issue with tournament policy. Player in question had warnings ie marked cards insufficient shuffling these get upgraded to game losses then match/dq on additional ones. The issue was on a 2 day event penalties are reset for day 2. In top 8 which was day 2 he once again got insufficent shuffling and marked cards but since was day 2 these were just warnings again.

last edited by TMPWDobs

@diophan said:

When Joseph stops riffle shuffling his deck, he is receiving verbal instructions from the judge to adjust his shuffle technique:

Immediately before the judge steps in, he has a group of cards isolated on the bottom that aren't being shuffled at all. This to me is probably the most striking in terms of intent (although some of the other videos show very blatant game rule violations)

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