Hum... can Oath abuse this guy? I like it because it is hard-castable and FoW'able too. But other than hitting Ancestral Recall and Dig Through Time, what else can we get?
EDIT: I searched for instants that cost more than 6 and the results were bad. There's Firemind's Foresight which can possibly tutor 3 cards.
You only need the instant to cost 4 or more to make it a value play if you wanna compare it to snapcaster. That is discounting the massive body this thing has.
Also your looking for instants to cast and you mentioned force of will but then did not note he can be flashed in to cast that as well?
I think 6 mana may just be too much, even though the card is fairly game winning by almost any measure.
The Gearhulks really make me wish there was a viable colored shops deck out there.
@Cambriel said:
The Gearhulks really make me wish there was a viable colored shops deck out there.
There is now...
Awkward, isn't he? He seems like a slam dunk in Blue Shops, to the extent that exists, (Master of Etherium ho!) but it requires instants and sorceries. So, not there.
Does it work in a Welder list? Is there a circumstance where you'd rather weld this out that something else that wins the game? Is it better than Snapcaster once you're in red/blue?
I honestly dont know. Card seems really spicy but I'm not sure how it stacks up to the existing roster.
Pitching to TFK, then welding In for a free TFK(or something spicier, like that yag will that got countered earlier) seems super cool to me.
Yay for reading... Only instants
Some kind of weird, janky blue shops with 4x misstep, force, gearhulk, and enough other blue cards to get your force of will count up sounds at least interesting enough to play in a local event. It wouldn't look anything like a real shops list though.
@Cambriel said:
The Gearhulks really make me wish there was a viable colored shops deck out there.
build one? I've played red, white and black shops decks. Played a bunch of multi colored combo decks powered by Workshop. There's Chromatic Lantern, Solemn Simulacrum and approximately 100 other color fixers.
If there was a game winning instant speed (like Enter the Infinite if it allowed sorceries)... because when you're flashing back Ancestral Recall or Dig Through Time you're probably better off putting Griselbrand into play. The only advantage I see in this is that it's easier to hardcast. Firemind's Foresight could get stuff like Ancestral, Time Walk and Yawgmoth's Will, but only if they aren't in the graveyard, so I don't know how reliable that could be.
Tezzerator Affinity? Is that a deck?
Play tons of free artifact mana, Blue counters, Frogmites, Force of will, Misstep, Thoughtcast, Academy, Tezz Agent of Bolas, protect it with this? I mean that seems reasonable.
Are ppl forgetting about Thirst and Gifts and FoF? This guys seems even more bonkers than Sundering Titan with Welder.
@fsecco said:
If there was a game winning instant speed (like Enter the Infinite if it allowed sorceries)... because when you're flashing back Ancestral Recall or Dig Through Time you're probably better off putting Griselbrand into play. The only advantage I see in this is that it's easier to hardcast. Firemind's Foresight could get stuff like Ancestral, Time Walk and Yawgmoth's Will, but only if they aren't in the graveyard, so I don't know how reliable that could be.
Firemind's Foresight is also Instants only.
@Serracollector Not quite where you want to be right now in the metagame.
I think I overreacted when I said this would be good in colored Shops. Why not just play this in a Drain deck, as a finisher? It's a 5/6 flash AND an artifact (Thirst for Knowledge? Welder?) AND Blue (FoW)
Not being able to get sorceries really kills this cards play ability. Goes from what would be a great card to almost unplayable.
So I've been tinkering with this (pun intended) in a paradoxical outcome deck. Its strong. Very strong. Well worth the 6 CC. I've had it as early as T2 and its a beating. A surprise blocker against mentors or eldrazi can swing the game very easily. I did wish in my first builds that it nabbed sorceries but I've adjusted the deck a bit to be very sorcery-light.
You Outcome for 4 or more, then Tinker/Hardcast this, then Outcome it back to your hand. So yes, it's strong.
PS: Candelabra of Tawnos.
@Soly It could also be worthwhile to use with Flash to get back Paradoxical Outcome for only two mana.
@fsecco The natural pairing with this card seems to be Gifts Ungiven (with honorable mention to Cryptic Command, Tsabo's Decree, and Ad Nauseam). Gifts can have synergy with other graveyard interactions that Oath of Druids enables and also with the Torrential Gearhulk itself. Although it can be Tinkered into play and also exiles to Force of Will I have my doubts that it would be better than what is already commonly used with Oath of Druids strategies. This is mainly because it only interacts with instants and doesn't have flying intrinsically.
If your main plan is to recast a card in your graveyard off of an oath activation Eternal Witness and Snapcaster Mage can accomplish similar tasks without ever being stranded in your hand. They still require you to pay the mana cost of the spell of course but playing higher mana spells like Gifts Ungiven creates a whole other set of issues in deck design by its self. If this were played in an oath deck that deck should probably contain several copies of Mana Drain as well.
The more I think about all the different instants this can re-cast the less certain I am about its interaction with Oath of Druids. Its probably worth testing at the very least. I think the biggest hurtles for a deck like this to overcome will be Flusterstorm and Gush token strategies.
