Crucibles and Razormane Masticores.

@nedleeds said:

Crucibles and Razormane Masticores.

Razormane just seems generally powerful at the moment with so many creatures running around. I'm surprised it hasn't popped up in a shops list.

@Cambriel said:

@nedleeds said:

Crucibles and Razormane Masticores.

Razormane just seems generally powerful at the moment with so many creatures running around. I'm surprised it hasn't popped up in a shops list.

I would think the discard aspect makes it less than desirable. A powerful effect is not enough to justify play (otherwise we'd see time stretch in every blue deck). With the rampant artifact removal, dacks and STPS/path of exile, coupled with shops inability to draw cards efficiently masticore just doesn't seem like a good T1 card right now.

Plus with the ability of mentor to generate more tokens than masticore can mow down, pyromancer tokens, eldrazi decks etc, masticore doesn't seem like a viable beatstick. A 4/4 that costs you card advantage doesn't cut it.

@studderingdave See the results of the TSI from this weekend to see my latest take on the deck, with 4x new thalia and playing stoneforge.

@Khahan said:

Plus with the ability of mentor to generate more tokens than masticore can mow down, pyromancer tokens, eldrazi decks etc, masticore doesn't seem like a viable beatstick. A 4/4 that costs you card advantage doesn't cut it.

Wrong Masticore. At 5/5 first strike, Razormane lines up a lot better against the whole eldrazi deck. It races very aggressively. The discard is a real cost, but if it's being spent popping off Mimics and Displacers it isn't so bad. I'll happily pitch a Thorn or something if it kills a Displacer, and binning lands with Crucible is as strong now as it ever was.

@Cambriel said:

@Khahan said:

Plus with the ability of mentor to generate more tokens than masticore can mow down, pyromancer tokens, eldrazi decks etc, masticore doesn't seem like a viable beatstick. A 4/4 that costs you card advantage doesn't cut it.

Wrong Masticore. At 5/5 first strike, Razormane lines up a lot better against the whole eldrazi deck. It races very aggressively. The discard is a real cost, but if it's being spent popping off Mimics and Displacers it isn't so bad. I'll happily pitch a Thorn or something if it kills a Displacer, and binning lands with Crucible is as strong now as it ever was.

Ahh yes. the first strike certainly helps it against other creatures it would normally trade with (if it didn't have first strike). But again, in this meta, a discard every turn only to lose it to exile or stp or have it stolen by dack or hit with shattering spree, nature's claim or any other pretty common artifact removal. So the razormane would do better than what I laid out above but I still think it falls short unless you incorporate some kind of card draw into your shops deck. I have certainly seen lists that do this. But not in eldrazi shops yet.

@Cambriel If we are thinking out of the box here, you can always make accommodations to your list to power manticores discard, provided he really is powerful enough an answer. You could go as far as running Squee in your list, but I would think doubling down on Crucible and pitching and playing lands would be the more desirable way to go.

@Khahan said:

@Cambriel said:

@nedleeds said:

Crucibles and Razormane Masticores.

Razormane just seems generally powerful at the moment with so many creatures running around. I'm surprised it hasn't popped up in a shops list.

I would think the discard aspect makes it less than desirable. A powerful effect is not enough to justify play (otherwise we'd see time stretch in every blue deck). With the rampant artifact removal, dacks and STPS/path of exile, coupled with shops inability to draw cards efficiently masticore just doesn't seem like a good T1 card right now.

Plus with the ability of mentor to generate more tokens than masticore can mow down, pyromancer tokens, eldrazi decks etc, masticore doesn't seem like a viable beatstick. A 4/4 that costs you card advantage doesn't cut it.

a) He asked for Eldrazi mirror tech not it's viability vs. Dack Fayden, Mentor and 'artifact removal'
b) You have the wrong Masticore

@JACO said:

You do not want to side out Warping Wail in the mirror. It kills opposing Mimics (or if against White Eldrazi, kills like 1/2 of their creatures). You can side out Null Rod in the unpowered "JacoDrazi" mirror for more removal, but you're honestly not that likely to face it.

My latest list has cut another Matter Reshaper for another Crucible main. I'm working on finishing up a very long piece for publication hopefully early this week that will be on EC.

Interestingly, I did play the JacoDrazi mirror in a recent event. I think you're onto something with playing another crucible. I won by cutting my opponent off all mana completely and having enough things to side in instead of Rods. He told me after the match that he had nothing to side in accept one Dismember. Makes casting Endless One for more than 5 feel pretty amazing due to your opponent's inability to answer it.

@10k Yeah, my current versions of JacoDrazi have 4-6 total Crucibles + Metamorphs total in the 75. I didn't play that many at NYSE4 because I didn't think as many would be needed that specific day (and that being said, my only loss on the day was to a Workshop deck that had first turn Lotus Crucible + Waste (or Strip). But the more Workshop + Eldrazi you expect in a given tournament, it's better to hedge on the safer side by including more. There are a lot of flexible slots to play with.

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