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    Eldrazi mirror tech

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    • 10k
      10k last edited by

      Hello all - I am new here (and to Vintage, really) but I have finally finished a list in paper that I intend to play at some upcoming side events at the Sydney GP. As the title suggests, I've built Eldrazi. I also suspect that there'll be more than one Eldrazi list at these events as it's one of the 'cheaper' ways to get a foot in the format. With this in mind, I'm wondering if anyone has any insights as to what could be good tech against an Eldrazi opponent in the mirror, rather than just racing to cast a Newlamog out of the side?

      I've been toying with the idea of a Tomb of the Spirit Dragon, or Jitte which have seen play with Eldrazi in other formats, but I'm just not quite convinced... Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

      I'm on the Colo[u]rless / Black list as per below...

      Land (25)
      4x Ancient Tomb
      4x Cavern of Souls
      4x Eldrazi Temple
      3x Eye of Ugin
      3x Ghost Quarter
      1x Strip Mine
      2x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
      4x Wasteland

      Creature (23)
      4x Eldrazi Mimic
      3x Endbringer
      4x Endless One
      2x Matter Reshaper
      2x Phyrexian Metamorph
      4x Reality Smasher
      4x Thought-Knot Seer

      Instant (6)
      3x Dismember
      3x Warping Wail

      Artifact (6)
      1x Chalice of the Void
      1x Crucible of Worlds
      4x Null Rod

      Finally, sorry if there has been other posts on this. I couldn't find anything in the search!

      "Anyone here play Australian Highlander?" - Me, in most rooms with Magic players.

      1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
      • L
        letseeker last edited by letseeker

        i personally have not played eldrazi and i havnt played against it much but to me it seems that crucible of worlds would be good against them, recur your wasteland effects to mana screw them, and when they waste you you can get the land back and you can end up with a mana advantage, maybe as a two of in the sideboard, plus it has splash damage against shops.

        10k 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 1
        • 10k
          10k @letseeker last edited by

          @letseeker More crucibles seems reasonable! Cheers!

          "Anyone here play Australian Highlander?" - Me, in most rooms with Magic players.

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          • Protoaddict
            Protoaddict last edited by

            Well, first things first you want to be able to side out the junk you no longer need for relevant cards.

            3x warping wail
            4 x null rod
            1 x Chalice

            That is 8 cards right there, so a lot of room to play. Things I would consider

            • 4th dismember - for obvious reasons, has other sideboard applications against other lists.
            • Waste - If they are on the ghost quarter plan, this is a nice land to have a copy of in the deck. Can be totally unexpected and lead to a real blowout, and works well otherwise with crucible as they only have so many ways to deal with it. Good against bloodmoon as well.
            • Extra Crucibles - For obvious reasons
            • Black lotus, sol ring, mana crypt - So interestingly enough, these become really quite strong if you are in a position where you can side out your null rods. Landing a turn 1 Thought Knot is really strong in a mirror match like this one. It feels strange to say play lotus in your side, but there it is. Against other decks where you would side out these cards like most white hatebears decks, they are also very good. I think the moxes though are just not good enough so i would stick to Sol, crypt, and lotus.
            • Jitte - Card is an established game winner, and if you can suddenly play it, it remains as such. Sol lands mean you can have this active as early as turn 2
            10k 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
            • 10k
              10k @Protoaddict last edited by

              @Protoaddct said:

              • Black lotus, sol ring, mana crypt - So interestingly enough, these become really quite strong if you are in a position where you can side out your null rods. Landing a turn 1 Thought Knot is really strong in a mirror match like this one. It feels strange to say play lotus in your side, but there it is. Against other decks where you would side out these cards like most white hatebears decks, they are also very good. I think the moxes though are just not good enough so i would stick to Sol, crypt, and lotus.

              This is a little out of my league, unfortunately. But something I'll keep in mind if I can borrow for paper, or if I go in on MODO for Vintage. I do own a Crypt and obviously Sol Rings in paper... but would they be worth it? I am finding it hard to judge!

              Right now my WIP board looks like this (based off Jason Jaco's colourless deck that came 10th at NYSE IV):
              4x Grafdigger's Cage
              4x Leyline of Sanctity
              4x Leyline of the Void
              2x Spatial Contortion
              1x Warping Wail

              The Leylines of Sanctity were in there for storm stuff... but could also be good against Endbringers and Thought-Knots if I brought them in? Seems bad and not totally worth it. Would that be better than the Wails, Rods and Chalice?

              Thinking that changing the Wail and/or a Contortion in the in the board for a Waste, Dismember, Jitte or further Crucible now though. DECISIONS.

              "Anyone here play Australian Highlander?" - Me, in most rooms with Magic players.

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              • J
                JuzamJim last edited by

                Warping Wail? WTF?

                1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                • JACO
                  JACO last edited by

                  You do not want to side out Warping Wail in the mirror. It kills opposing Mimics (or if against White Eldrazi, kills like 1/2 of their creatures). You can side out Null Rod in the unpowered "JacoDrazi" mirror for more removal, but you're honestly not that likely to face it.

                  My latest list has cut another Matter Reshaper for another Crucible main. I'm working on finishing up a very long piece for publication hopefully early this week that will be on EC.

                  Find me on Twitter @JMJACO and @EternalCentral. If you have an interest in Vintage Eldrazi, check out my book Eldrazi Meditations.

                  10k 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 4
                  • studderingdave
                    studderingdave last edited by

                    Looking forward to that. i play white eldrazi but i am tempted to go in on the tribal version for a bit.

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                    • garbageaggro
                      garbageaggro TMD Supporter last edited by

                      If you are playing white eldrazi, turns out that new Thalia is pretty good in the mirror. I have also really liked some number of stoneforges in the matchup for both Jitte and Batterskull.

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                      • studderingdave
                        studderingdave last edited by

                        I feel like white eldrazi is a version of Vintage Death and Taxes and I like that. That WhiteTrash builds are forgoing the SFM package but I might look into it if I can work the new Thalia into my build.

                        garbageaggro 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                        • ?
                          A Former User last edited by

                          Forcefield is the mirror breaker.

                          But no one plays the card for whatever reason and unlike other cards on the reserve list, it hasn't spiked.

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                          • Twiedel
                            Twiedel last edited by

                            If you are not using Null Rod in said mirror and don't think your opponent will, you should try out Skullclamp. Absolute Powerhouse and nearly unbeatable in a creature based mirror. All the cards!

                            I'm not so sure Forcefield will do much in a mirror, as threats will be mainly traded anyway, won't they?

                            Just an idea, never played the deck 😛

                            Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire.
                            -Jaya Ballard, Task Mage

                            nedleeds 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                            • nedleeds
                              nedleeds @Twiedel last edited by

                              Crucibles and Razormane Masticores.

                              @TeamTuskMTG on Twitter
                              Sometimes caster on Tusk Talk

                              Cambriel 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                              • Cambriel
                                Cambriel @nedleeds last edited by

                                @nedleeds said:

                                Crucibles and Razormane Masticores.

                                Razormane just seems generally powerful at the moment with so many creatures running around. I'm surprised it hasn't popped up in a shops list.

                                K 1 Reply Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                • K
                                  Khahan @Cambriel last edited by

                                  @Cambriel said:

                                  @nedleeds said:

                                  Crucibles and Razormane Masticores.

                                  Razormane just seems generally powerful at the moment with so many creatures running around. I'm surprised it hasn't popped up in a shops list.

                                  I would think the discard aspect makes it less than desirable. A powerful effect is not enough to justify play (otherwise we'd see time stretch in every blue deck). With the rampant artifact removal, dacks and STPS/path of exile, coupled with shops inability to draw cards efficiently masticore just doesn't seem like a good T1 card right now.

                                  Plus with the ability of mentor to generate more tokens than masticore can mow down, pyromancer tokens, eldrazi decks etc, masticore doesn't seem like a viable beatstick. A 4/4 that costs you card advantage doesn't cut it.

                                  Cambriel nedleeds 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                  • garbageaggro
                                    garbageaggro TMD Supporter @studderingdave last edited by

                                    @studderingdave See the results of the TSI from this weekend to see my latest take on the deck, with 4x new thalia and playing stoneforge.

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                                    • Cambriel
                                      Cambriel @Khahan last edited by

                                      @Khahan said:

                                      Plus with the ability of mentor to generate more tokens than masticore can mow down, pyromancer tokens, eldrazi decks etc, masticore doesn't seem like a viable beatstick. A 4/4 that costs you card advantage doesn't cut it.

                                      Wrong Masticore. At 5/5 first strike, Razormane lines up a lot better against the whole eldrazi deck. It races very aggressively. The discard is a real cost, but if it's being spent popping off Mimics and Displacers it isn't so bad. I'll happily pitch a Thorn or something if it kills a Displacer, and binning lands with Crucible is as strong now as it ever was.

                                      K Protoaddict 2 Replies Last reply Reply Quote 0
                                      • K
                                        Khahan @Cambriel last edited by

                                        @Cambriel said:

                                        @Khahan said:

                                        Plus with the ability of mentor to generate more tokens than masticore can mow down, pyromancer tokens, eldrazi decks etc, masticore doesn't seem like a viable beatstick. A 4/4 that costs you card advantage doesn't cut it.

                                        Wrong Masticore. At 5/5 first strike, Razormane lines up a lot better against the whole eldrazi deck. It races very aggressively. The discard is a real cost, but if it's being spent popping off Mimics and Displacers it isn't so bad. I'll happily pitch a Thorn or something if it kills a Displacer, and binning lands with Crucible is as strong now as it ever was.

                                        Ahh yes. the first strike certainly helps it against other creatures it would normally trade with (if it didn't have first strike). But again, in this meta, a discard every turn only to lose it to exile or stp or have it stolen by dack or hit with shattering spree, nature's claim or any other pretty common artifact removal. So the razormane would do better than what I laid out above but I still think it falls short unless you incorporate some kind of card draw into your shops deck. I have certainly seen lists that do this. But not in eldrazi shops yet.

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                                        • Protoaddict
                                          Protoaddict @Cambriel last edited by

                                          @Cambriel If we are thinking out of the box here, you can always make accommodations to your list to power manticores discard, provided he really is powerful enough an answer. You could go as far as running Squee in your list, but I would think doubling down on Crucible and pitching and playing lands would be the more desirable way to go.

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                                          • nedleeds
                                            nedleeds @Khahan last edited by

                                            @Khahan said:

                                            @Cambriel said:

                                            @nedleeds said:

                                            Crucibles and Razormane Masticores.

                                            Razormane just seems generally powerful at the moment with so many creatures running around. I'm surprised it hasn't popped up in a shops list.

                                            I would think the discard aspect makes it less than desirable. A powerful effect is not enough to justify play (otherwise we'd see time stretch in every blue deck). With the rampant artifact removal, dacks and STPS/path of exile, coupled with shops inability to draw cards efficiently masticore just doesn't seem like a good T1 card right now.

                                            Plus with the ability of mentor to generate more tokens than masticore can mow down, pyromancer tokens, eldrazi decks etc, masticore doesn't seem like a viable beatstick. A 4/4 that costs you card advantage doesn't cut it.

                                            a) He asked for Eldrazi mirror tech not it's viability vs. Dack Fayden, Mentor and 'artifact removal'
                                            b) You have the wrong Masticore

                                            @TeamTuskMTG on Twitter
                                            Sometimes caster on Tusk Talk

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