I wish I would have considered this card years ago for Pitch Long, Grim Long, and TPS brews. In the modern Vintage metagame, I would have to consider it for DPS and possibly Doomsday. (Dark Ritual decks)

Most of the time this card isn’t going to win on the spot. But what I like about it is that it’s a permanent-based draw engine. It should be countered by the opponent if they have a counter. So it would be in the “bomb” or “threat” territory. Ritual decks would be the natural homes since Dark and Cabal Rituals can mitigate the initial mana cost. Given a turn 1 Duress, this should reliably land on turn 2 and provide a path to victory by drawing a ton of cards. Similar to Necropotence. Not as good, but it seems good enough as a 1-of. It won’t eat a Red Blast or a Flusterstorm. Just an alternative engine for getting ahead. I’ve never considered trying it until now.

yawgmoth's bargain isn't even restricted anymore

This card is not a great fit for how modern doomsdy decks are designed as we tend to run very low land and mana in general counts so a 4 drop we cant pitch is not a good inclusion. The card is not a write off but would require more aggressive deck shifts than simply sliding it into a flex slot.

@blindtherapy said in [LEG] Greed:

yawgmoth's bargain isn't even restricted anymore

Well I think Bolas’ Citadel is better than Bargain, so I or anyone would probably play at least 2 Citadels before the first Bargain.

Greed on the other hand serves a very different role. Since it costs 2 less mana to bring into play, it serves the roll of a weaker 4-mana threat that can be deployed when you only have 4 mana. I have seen the power of 4 mana threats in DPS 2 years ago when Karn DPS won Asian World Champs. It’s just nice having a good mana curve in my opinion.

I think it's just more of the fact that it's not truly a 4-mana draw engine. Each draw costs B and 2 life...where as all the other options mentioned are mana free. You need to spend 5 mana and 2 life to draw even 1 card...so something like Necrologia seems a more efficient reload - and that card is terrible.

I think any one-shot 3-4 mana draw 3+ is better here. Even a lesser card like Divination (I assume you're in blue too) gives you an immediate 3 cards for no extra mana or life. If you're paying 8 mana and 8 life over multiple turns to get a single card better than Divination, that's bad imo.

@thewhitedragon69

It’s not 5 mana draw 1 though. It’s 4 mana up front and then 1 black for 1 card at your leisure as long as it stays in play. Hypothetically this could convert unused mana every turn into cards OR just draw as many cards as you can over a turn or 2. That should be good game. No other card mentioned does that for just 4 mana. It isn’t 5 mana. It isn’t 6 mana. It’s 4 mana and will never require any mana beyond 4. I never mentioned anything about blue or blue sorceries. This is a black card that requires black mana that is conveniently generated with Rituals. You mentioned Divination. Divination draws 2 cards. Greed draws up to 9 cards... and that doesn’t mean it costs 13 mana.

You should at least be able to see the fact that if you untap with Greed in play, you’re probably going to win the game because of Greed. I mean “EoT Draw 7” is nothing to scoff at. Cannot say the same thing for Divination, Fact or Fiction, or whatever else you want to talk about. Especially when considering immunity to the most popular counterspells

last edited by LieNielsen

@lienielsen said in [LEG] Greed:

You should at least be able to see the fact that if you untap with Greed in play, you’re probably going to win the game because of Greed. I mean “EoT Draw 7” is nothing to scoff at. Cannot say the same thing for Divination, Fact or Fiction, or whatever else you want to talk about. Especially when considering immunity to the most popular counterspells

I mean, this is all true, but you're making some pretty hefty assumptions in that "EoT Draw 7" example - namely, this implies that you have 7 black mana and 14 life to spare. A lot of cards would win you the game in that situation, including some mentioned previously (Bargain, Citadel).

@lienielsen I guess I named the wrong card - I was thinking of the 2UU draw 3 (Concentrate). Regardless, 4 mana for a do nothing that turn is a bit slow. And the "draw 9" also comes at the expense of 18 life. That means fetches and FoW add a toll. Yes, you can cast this, untap, and then pump BBBB+8 life into it EoT for 4 cards over 2 turns (or dumping rituals into it, which basically trades a card for a card), but then you have done nothing for 2 turns except draw 4 cards and lose 8 life. If you are playing a deck like pitch long or DPS, you want big value or explosiveness in a card - like necropotence, citadel, memory jar, or the like.

If you are just looking to lower the curve on card draw and stay entirely in black, night's whisper, treacherous blessing, infernal contract are all things, and not really that good. Infernal Contract is at worst 10 life and comes off a single ritual. For the same 4 cards, you pay 8 life and 3B+BBBB over two turns with greed. If IC isn't playable in the same deck, I fail to see how Greed is as good or better.

And vs matches like aggroshops or vengevine or dredge where your life will be quickly pressured, IC can get you 4 cards for as little as 1 life if they bumrush you down to 2 life...Greed wouldn't net you a single card in that case.

last edited by Thewhitedragon69

On average, I am pretty sure in any Ritual Based storm list, even Dark Confidant trumps Greed. In life cost, mana cost, permanent draw, and as a threat. In the current metagame it might even be less likely to die, seems to be more Force of Vigors than bolts and plows from what I've seen of late. Greed is great in Old School, but there are so many better options now.

I literally have no idea why you would consider Greed in Vintage. It's VERY underpowered. There are so many things better than it that I can't even list them all. Even the unplayed Fact of Fiction is better. Or Ad Nauseam, or Dark Bargain or Moonlight Bargain or Mazemind Tome or whatever.

Edit: I mean, you know that at 4 mana you can play Jace, right? Or the above mentioned Karn?

last edited by fsecco

@fsecco I think the OP is looking to stay in black and be a cheaper-than-bargain card-drawing bomb. I like Infernal Contract myself as a 3-mana draw-4 that isn't limited by your life total (unless you are at 1)...and that's pretty unplayable.

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