[IKO] Lurrus of the Dream-Den
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This feels like it may already slot into an existing shell that plays black. Besides being +1 starting hand size as all the companions are, this lets you replay lotus for free every turn or bring back a combo piece from key vault.
Being able to go like Turn one - Land, Lotus, Mox This, Replay Lotus, Standstill (or whatever) and have lotus mana up feels VERY strong. Also works well seal of whatever cards which are sometimes corner case playable.
I def see a place for this somewhere.
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I’m a bit skeptical: sure you get a Lotus every turn, but what are you casting with it? You’re losing Narset, Mentor, Jace, Tez...
This creature seems much better in the main deck than as a companion, where it has “haste” compared to Emry’s affinity and self-mill.
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This could just be fine main deck in a shell that plays vault/key/underworld breach. You get to replay breach every turn after you use it for value early and combo out into Thassa (which also costs 2cmc). Sort of a B/U/R vault/key/breach/brain freeze/thassa combo deck. Seems a bit cute when just oathing into sun titan seems better.
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No one is actually saying where I could REALLY see this seeing play: a hatebear deck. Just keep it to 2-drops only. Yeah boooyyyyyy!
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I’d put together white weenie (or GW hatebears) just to play this thing. I haven’t picked up white weenie since Samurai of the pale curtain was printed.
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This seems pretty bad in a Hatebears deck (and in general). Without even taking the restraints it puts on your deckbuilding options into consideration, it' just a 3/2 for 3 that let's you cast one extra card each turn (if that card is already in your graveyard). Dark Confidant seems infinitely better.
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@griselbrother DC doesn't start as the 8th card in your opening hand every game though.
Iam however also skeptical from a DPS perspective since it won't let you play Necro, Bargain or Citadel -
I'm def going to play around with it in a standstill variant, though I am entirely unsure if it makes more sense to add white or black to the deck. There were very few permanents over 3 in that list to start with, the biggest hit is losing crucible.
It also notably has interaction with LED as early as turn 1, which may in turn make it a very solid breach enabler.
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@protoaddict said in [IKO] Lurrus of the Dream-Den:
I'm def going to play around with it in a standstill variant, though I am entirely unsure if it makes more sense to add white or black to the deck. There were very few permanents over 3 in that list to start with, the biggest hit is losing crucible.
It also notably has interaction with LED as early as turn 1, which may in turn make it a very solid breach enabler.
Why Standstill? Of all decks, Landstill benefits the most from not casting spells - and when they do, they want to play counters. What permanents do Landstill even play besides Standstill and moxen? I mean in your above example, you get this card into play and then it doesn't do anything but attack for 3 because your very own Standstill prevents it's ability from being useful.
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@griselbrother said in [IKO] Lurrus of the Dream-Den:
@protoaddict said in [IKO] Lurrus of the Dream-Den:
I'm def going to play around with it in a standstill variant, though I am entirely unsure if it makes more sense to add white or black to the deck. There were very few permanents over 3 in that list to start with, the biggest hit is losing crucible.
It also notably has interaction with LED as early as turn 1, which may in turn make it a very solid breach enabler.
Why Standstill? Of all decks, Landstill benefits the most from not casting spells - and when they do, they want to play counters. What permanents do Landstill even play besides Standstill and moxen? I mean in your above example, you get this card into play and then it doesn't do anything but attack for 3 because your very own Standstill prevents it's ability from being useful.
Well, if my opening turn is putting a 3/2 lifelink into play along with a standstill, a land, and maybe a mox, and maybe even a lotus, it puts faster pressure on my opponent than the deck normally could muster and all but ensures my opponent cannot sit around and wait. Think of it as a soft combo where you start with an 8 card starting hand and 1 is a combo piece every time.
In the best case scenario, this guy functions as a control finisher that does not cost you a card in your deck, gives you +1 hand size, always starts in your hand, cannot be thoughtseized away away, and cannot be drawn by accident when you are trying to draw into countermagic. That's a lot for a card to provide.
And the deck really need not play many more permanents than landstill and lotus because those are the ones you want to recycle most of the time, but breach is an option, most of the grave hate like Nihli spellbomb can be put back every turn once this guy sticks.
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I personally thought of Goblin Welder, Goblin Engineer, and the painter grindstone combos. It would probably need to be a RWB deck and run cardslike Ethersworn Cannonist and Duress efx. But this card would be most beneficial in a list like that imo.
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@protoaddict I think you'd have to have lotus/landstill in hand for that to work. You could cast lotus, cast Lurrus, replay lotus, cast landstill. But outside of opening with lotus, I don't see the real benefit. Are you running it as one of your SB slots (all 15 seem precious to me) just on the off chance you open with lotus and landstill in your opener? It won't work with LED as you can only get back one permanent a turn (either LED or Standstill), and then you've discarded all your countermagic anyway, which seems godawful.
In theory, being able to repeatedly recast standstill is nice, but those and lotus are really the only 5 permanents in your deck you can recast. And if they break your standstill, it's to attempt to kill Lurrus, which means you aren't getting the ability anymore. It just seems like you are dedicating one SB slot and splashing a color for the Chrismasland scenario. It's a fine thing when it happens, but I'd rather that extra hurkyll's/trickbind/dredge hate piece in that 15th slot of the SB.
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I hate this mechanic btw. For some reason I hope that all cards with this mechanic get banned outside of EDH variants.
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@aelien Why is that? I find pre-game mechanics to be almost entirely unexplored. I think Vintage NEEDS more things like this to level the playing field actually. I love that this card says cmc 2 or less. This rules out Oko and Dack and Teferi from being included in a deck. I LOOOVE that restriction.
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I don't like that it takes a SB slot. If they would have said "Command Zone" was a legal zone in Vintage, I'd be okay with it a bit more (without actually having anything but these companions being commanders). I don't like these overall and don't like the idea of having something in hand every opener no matter what. I also dislike when the SB becomes an extension of your deck in the main. I also run Karn/lattice...and I hate it...but it's too good not to do. I don't like the direction of decks becoming 75 cards in G1.
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@stormanimagus said in [IKO] Lurrus of the Dream-Den:
@aelien Why is that? I find pre-game mechanics to be almost entirely unexplored. I think Vintage NEEDS more things like this to level the playing field actually. I love that this card says cmc 2 or less. This rules out Oko and Dack and Teferi from being included in a deck. I LOOOVE that restriction.
This will level the playing field when they make a companion that has vintage+ level power that has a deck building requirement that you cannot have 0 mana artifacts in your deck.
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@protoaddict the remaining color pairs are RW and UW. while it is entirely possible that the UW one ends up being broken because Blue, i think "you don't get to play artifacts in the same deck as this"(they are unlikely to print something specifically against moxen) would have been the RG one.
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@blindtherapy You know the UW one is going to be something stupid like:
1{U/W}{U/W}
"You can't play enchantments that cost 1 or less in your starting deck"
When you cast a spell, you win the game
Indestructible, can't be countered
50/50...because that's how blue rolls in Vintage.
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I almost don't think you can do it with a creature or without breaking standard. It would have to be something so narrowly tailored to the format that they were obviously building it just to foster a new archetype.
G
Your starting deck cannot contain any artifacts that cost 1 or less
Hexproof, flying
Null rod/Grafdiggers cage
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@protoaddict hell, I'd play that in dredge
