If Probe was unrestricted I could see it being better. But I feel having to give PO, Oath or Dredge one more turn before you hit them with hate might be too late.

It can also find Moat (which is not as good as it is last year but who knows).

In Depths it can find both Solemnity and Mirage Mirror and also Depths via Expedition Map so it seems great there.

last edited by fsecco

It's really hard for me to see any of the 2 card combos (including those that I mentioned) as anything other than worse versions of Vault/Key ... are there artifacts/enchantments I'm missing that are worth tutoring against blue decks and don't need another support card?

@topical_island said in Enlightened Tutor:

And not to be snarky, but it can eat a Misstep ...

This paragraph doesn't sound snarky to me ... it just sounds like the way good players think about Misstep. I'm honestly a little confused how you can see that and then also think there's an overpopulation problem, but we can leave any meta-metagame concerns to PM, or at least threads outside the Strategy section 🙂

last edited by Brass Man

@brass-man said in Enlightened Tutor:

What else can we do with it?

Tutoring for Aegis of the Gods, Spirit of the Labyrinth, or Ethersworn Canonist?

One can also get tormod's crypt/relic/bomb against dredge.
I am not sure there is one special great bomb to get with that tutor but its versality may make it interesting : one can get with it a hate card for about every matchup. This is a nice toolbox (but i don't know if it is really needed, blue decks may have already enough digging effects to get reliably enough their tools when needed ?)

People often side out Vampiric against Blue so not likely to fit in that matchup. I've always thought of E.T.'s role in Vintage as a sideboard space enabler against linear decks without counterspells. Like ET, Dredge Hate, Shops Hate, instead of 2 of 1 and only 1 of the other. Besides this role, for E.T. to be good, the target would have to be indestructible or uncounterable or be usable from the graveyard, but nothing really fits the bill. Or an STP-resistant artifact or enchantment creature, but again, nothing.

@brass-man Yeah... No worries on that discussion. It seems humanly, if not outright mathematically impossible to say anything I haven't said already about Misstep on this site. And if anything is more overpopulated than Misstep, it's my posts on this site...

Something I wanted to ask you about, were your thoughts on the interaction between, (and this might be a stretch,) Enlightened Tutor and Mana Drain.

It seems like the general feeling is that taxing effects, and fast, aggro decks have severely decreased the effectiveness of Mana Drain. I buy that to a point, but my feeling is that big blue really lacks deck manipulation instants in the vein of Brainstorm to plat EOT. Playing a second blue source and saying go, is way way better when, if your opponent does nothing, you get to EOT spend that mana on something. You get to kind of terrorize the opponent into a virtual mana advantage, by forcing the opponent to choose between playing through Mana Drain, or doing nothing and watching while you EOT deck manipulate them into the dust.

These days, the Brainstorm restriction makes that impossible, and Mana Drain is kinda lamely positioned. Now my feeling is that Brainstorm is way, way better than Enlightened Tutor, but I guess my question to you or... really to anyone, is to what extent do you think some combination of 1x Brainstorm, 1x Vamp, and ?x Enlightened could do that job in a big blue deck under present conditions?

last edited by Topical_Island

Impulse and telling time are the cards your looking for to punish people for not wanting to play into a potential drain. It’s a strategy that I’ve employed for years and was the backbone of the jacestorm deck in 2010 my splinter twin deck from 2 years and now the saheeli combo deck I mess around with

@fisken @Topical_Island Yeah even the Peek that Brian Kelly is playing in Oath seems better actually. Oh the good old Skeletal Scrying days...

Back to Basics or Bloodmoon are good targets for ET that hose blue decks. In the Eye of Chaos? Also Yawgmoths Bargain is unrestricted, and usually plays Rector. 4 Rector, 4 Bargain, 4 ET, 1 Vamp, 1 DT seems it could be something.

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