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Author Topic: Bant with Null Rod  (Read 2066 times)
Guli
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« on: August 23, 2011, 01:32:48 PM »

It has been suggested that I post this list somewere. This deck is designed to beat Blue and Workshop and with enough practice and skill it does just that. The exceptions are those games were the Blue or Shop has a nearly unbeatable hand. But you get those too,occasionally, most of the time involving Black Lotus. I wanted to share the list, if possible receive some feedback. But that is not mandatory.

The list has been tested against blue and shop but not in a tournament environment.

First the list then some explanations afterwards:

Quote
4 Savannah
4 Tundra
2 Seachrome Coast
1 Razorverge Thicket
4 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
2 Ghost Quarter

1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Emerald

4 Noble Hierarch
4 Elvish Spirit Guide

3 Null Rod
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk

4 Trygon Predator
3 Kataki, War's Wage

4 Cursecatcher
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Glowrider

4 Phantasmal Image
2 Phyrexian Metamorph

SB: 3 Flusterstorm
SB: 3 Surgical Extraction
SB: 3 Ravenous Trap
SB: 2 Ghost Quarter
SB: 3 Nature's Claim
SB: 1 Kataki, War's Wage



The plan against Blue

Blue decks tend to get really aggressive with drawing, tutoring and support that with artifact acceleration. The plan is to slow that down with mana denial like Fish decks do. But this deck is radically committed. Cursecatcher into Leonin Arbiter into Glowrider is for example a general plan. Of course this doesn't always happen in this order but these are the cards, supported by Null Rod and Kataki, to make it hard for the blue deck. They will try to play around it obviously. The cheap clones make this creature base extra dangerous while also being an answer to Tinker. So it doesn't matter if you clone Arbiter or hold Phantasmal Image in your hand. They will both work to disrupt the Tinker plan. In the tests it showed that after your first mansphere resolves, the rest resolves easier and the game becomes easier. That is why cursecatcher is important against things like mana drain and Force of Will. Getting through your Leonin or Glowrider will gain massive tempo.

You side out Kataki and bring in Flusterstorm. You could also leave Kataki in, if you see things like Grim Monolith/Key.. and side out a couple Trygon Predator. Against lists that use Trygon I would leave in the Trygons myself.



The plan against Workshop


You just try to resolve Trygon Predator and then clone it as much as you can. It is that simple. Kataki and the 7 strip effects main deck keep them low on the mana and resources. Noble and Elvish Spirit Guide play a critical role in getting the Predator and Kataki in play. I say this list is positioned nicely to make this plan work g1. Game 2 your job gets a lot easier. You board out the white bears and get in claims, ghost quarters, the 4th Kataki and some surgicals to have some grave hate against wastelands and welders. Normally the surgicals should stay in the SB but it is better to get them in and side out Glowiders and a Leonin (could come in handy against Forgemaster builds or block Panters).

-4 Cursecatcher, -4 Glowrider, -1 Leonin Arbiter
+1 Kataki, +3 Nature's Claim, +2 Ghost Quarter, +3 Surgical Extraction


The clones are what make this list interesting and dangerous to play against. You can't win against multiple Trygons as Workshop and you can't win against multiple Glowriders as Blue. This deck follows a prison strategy but at the same time has an inbound resilience against big fat creatures because of the clones. But any time it can cast those clones to lock you out instead of holding the 'answer to tinker' in their hand.

In this deck Null Rod really shines and will have a strangling effect on the opponent. If you expect a meta full of Blue/Tinker/Combo this deck is a good choice if you are a Rod-Fish player. You will have a strong game against Shop and Dredge especially G2 and G3.

We haven't tested the mirror but let me quote one of my testing partners:
'Nobody plays fish, if fish is your weakest match up, you should be happy!'


My experience tells me that this deck will do fine against aggro control with the Trygons, Clones and the mana denial plan. But, should be tested. And it is easy to strengthen the mirror if you expect a meta full of Fish. It is less easy to consistently beat Blue, Shop and Dredge.



I hope this was interesting enough,
Guli
« Last Edit: August 23, 2011, 01:38:41 PM by Guli » Logged
Guli
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« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2011, 10:33:32 AM »

I have been reading a couple of articles and sit down and thought about how to handle workshop.

Ritual based combo tries to use hurkly's recall but has to go off the next turn or it would all be for nothing. While Gush decks have Trygon predator to get them there.

My strategy with fish involves attacking there mana base aggressively to cut them of Workshop. This is a pretty easy thing to do, the problem is whatever does get through the lines before you establish a serious mana advantage. You usually need some kind of removal in these scenario's like STP or Claim/Qasali.

My solution is pretty simple when you think about it. If you are dedicated to destroying there lands, believe me you will get there as a Fish, but at the cost of having problems casting your own things and in this case, Trygon predator. The card you want alongside the land destruction is a mass removal spell so they are totally cut off and stuck with there expensive spells in there hand. When you are opting to cut them off mana, a spell like hurkly's recall just becomes that mass removal spell. So the plan is to bounce everything they got after wasteland, strip and quarter there lands. I believe this is a very effective strategy to follow.

You have additional answers versus Tinker and frankly, when I look at the main deck, that win con is totally neutralized on all levels. You can stop tinker, or disrupt it. you can copy the target and now you can bounce it. And all this is just is just bonus to a working strategy. Kataki is the card to go to make room. Also Flusterstorm seemed win more and I added Tarmogoyf in the SB to get a strong clock against combo and strong body against aggro.

4 Savannah
4 Tundra
2 Seachrome Coast
1 Razorverge Thicket
4 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
2 Ghost Quarter

1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Emerald

4 Noble Hierarch
4 Elvish Spirit Guide

4 Null Rod
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk

3 Trygon Predator
2 Hurkly's Recall

4 Cursecatcher
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Glowrider

4 Phantasmal Image
3 Phyrexian Metamorph

SB: 3 Tarmogoyf
SB: 3 Surgical Extraction
SB: 3 Ravenous Trap
SB: 2 Ghost Quarter
SB: 2 Hyrkly's Recall
SB: 2 Swords to Plowshares
« Last Edit: August 31, 2011, 02:23:29 AM by Guli » Logged
Guli
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« Reply #2 on: September 04, 2011, 04:57:06 AM »

A couple of updates/changes for this Bant-Rod approach:

4 Savannah
4 Tundra
2 Seachrome Coast
1 Razorverge Thicket
4 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
2 Ghost Quarter

1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Emerald

4 Noble Hierarch
4 Elvish Spirit Guide

3 Null Rod
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk

3 Trygon Predator
2 Hurkly's Recall

4 Cursecatcher
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Glowrider
3 Phyrexian Revoker

4 Phantasmal Image
1 Phyrexian Metamorph

SB: 3 Path to Exile
SB: 3 Surgical Extraction
SB: 3 Ravenous Trap
SB: 2 Ghost Quarter
SB: 2 Hyrkly's Recall
SB: 1 Nature's Claim
SB: 1 Trygon Predator

These are small but subtle changes. Instead of 4 Null Rod we are playing 3/3 Rod/Revoker which is better because they can supplement each other. Also 3x Path to Exile in the Sideboard to bring in versus problematic creatures but not Tinker or Oath. You can bring it in versus Metalworker and Precursor or Shop in general to deal with all their critters. You don't want it main deck because they don't help versus blue/x that much.
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Guli
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« Reply #3 on: September 05, 2011, 09:24:25 AM »

FINAL TWEAKS

After more test games we decided the plan with Hurkly's recall, strip effects and Trygon is strong and rolls over Workshop. But there was a small problem with the main deck and SB balance. It is better to go for this plan in G2 and G3 WITHOUT Glowrider than to try to execute this plan G1. That is why we moved the 4x Hurkly's Recall to the Sideboard and moved the Path to Exile to the main which will also help a lot against Workshop, Tinker and many more issues. I think this fix is sound and logical.

Here is the "most recent" list  in the light of
Quote
Currently, there are three decks that are popular and very good. They include the Gush/Bob deck that Meandeck played at Vintage Champs, Cat Stax Fever, and Sun Titan Dredge.
By Matt Elias
09/02/2011


4 Savannah
4 Tundra
2 Seachrome Coast
1 Razorverge Thicket
4 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
2 Ghost Quarter

1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Emerald

4 Noble Hierarch
4 Elvish Spirit Guide

3 Null Rod
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
3 Path to Exile

3 Trygon Predator

4 Cursecatcher
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Glowrider
3 Phyrexian Revoker

4 Phantasmal Image

SB: 3 Surgical Extraction
SB: 3 Ravenous Trap
SB: 2 Ghost Quarter
SB: 4 Hyrkly's Recall
SB: 1 Path to Exile
SB: 1 Nature's Claim
SB: 1 Trygon Predator

SPECIFIC SIDEBOARD INSTRUCTIONS:

versus Gush/Bob
Depending on their creature count and win conditions you are free to bring in Predator and Path. You can also side out Predator to bring in the anti tutor/will/colour screwer Surgical Extraction. The deck is designed to squeeze the blue strategy.


versus Cat Stax Fever or Workshop in general
-4 Cursecatcher
-4 Leonin Arbiter
-4 Glowrider

+4 Hurkly's Recall
+1 Trygon Predator
+1 Nature's Claim
+1 Path to Exile
+2 Ghost Quarter
+3 Surgical Extraction

versus Dredge
-3 Null Rod
-4 Leonin Arbiter
-3 Trygon Predator

+3 Surgical Extraction
+3 Ravenous Trap
+2 Ghost Quarter
+1 Path to Exile
+1 Nature's Claim


Good luck,

Guli
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Guli
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« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2011, 04:14:20 AM »

This list might be open to Kataki and the new Null Rod enchantment. I think it is worth testing it out.

And here is the new list post Innistrad:

4 Savannah
4 Tundra
2 Seachrome Coast
1 Razorverge Thicket
4 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
2 Ghost Quarter

1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Emerald

4 Noble Hierarch
4 Elvish Spirit Guide

4 Stony Silence

1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
3 Path to Exile

3 Trygon Predator
1 Edric, Spymaster of Trest

4 Cursecatcher
4 Leonin Arbiter
4 Glowrider
2 Kataki, War's Wage

3 Phantasmal Image

SB: 4 Surgical Extraction
SB: 3 Ravenous Trap
SB: 1 Ghost Quarter
SB: 4 Hyrkly's Recall
SB: 1 Path to Exile
SB: 1 Nature's Claim
SB: 1 Trygon Predator
« Last Edit: September 26, 2011, 06:36:10 AM by Guli » Logged
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