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Author Topic: Type 4 Created Cards Proxies  (Read 12039 times)
thorme
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« Reply #30 on: October 23, 2008, 12:28:08 PM »

We haven't actually proxied it up for the stack yet, but here's a neat one SliverKing came up with for our stack:

Prisoner's Dilemma
UUUURRRR
Sorcery
Choose any number of target opponents.  Each opponent chosen this way chooses and reveals a non-land card. The player who reveals the card with the lowest converted mana cost takes damage equal to highest converted mana cost revealed this way.  The player who reveals the card with the highest converted mana cost gains life equal to the lowest converted mana cost revealed this way.  Draw cards equal to the highest converted mana cost revealed this way.


Note that it mimicks the game theory problem of the "Prisonner's Dilemma"  where the best group wide solution is to cooperate (ie - reveal low cc's), but the best individual solution is to screw the other players (ie - reveal high cc's).
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« Reply #31 on: October 23, 2008, 01:57:20 PM »

I really like this idea.  The function of this card surely makes it feel like a sorcery, but is there a good reason to not make it an instant?  I don't think it's really too broken (for one, an opponent of yours is going to gain some life - cant be that broken), and the card is a lot more fun if actually gets cast.

You really need to refine the wording here a little bit.  As it's written it's not clear how this actually plays out.

#1 I'd assume that the intention is for everyone to reveal their card at the same time.  To facilitate that you may want to word it that each player sets a non-land card face down, and then all the cards are revealed simultaneously.

#2 What happens if people reveal the same number? what if it's revealed like player A= 5 player B = 5 player C =2

What happens if they all pick 5?

#3 any number of target opponents... does this card make much sense to play on only 1 person?

#4 what if one of the targeted opponent's doesn't have a non-land card in hand?

I'm usually good at templating cards, but this is a really tough one. 
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« Reply #32 on: October 23, 2008, 05:36:20 PM »

Just feels like a sorcery, but no issues w/ switching it up to an instant.

Re: your questions...

#1:  Yeah, I'm no templating guru

#2:  Ties mean the effect happens to everyone with the highest or lowest.  In your example, Players A and B each gain 2 life, Player C takes 5 damage, and the caster draws 5 cards.

#3:  No, but at least it still cycles and does a mini-peek once the game is down to 2 people.

#4:  I would want that person to not count towards the spell in any way...again, no clue how to template.
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« Reply #33 on: October 23, 2008, 08:23:32 PM »

Prisoner's Dilemma
UUUURRRR
Sorcery
Choose any number of target opponents.  Each opponent chosen this way chooses and reveals a non-land card. The player who reveals the card with the lowest converted mana cost takes damage equal to highest converted mana cost revealed this way.  The player who reveals the card with the highest converted mana cost gains life equal to the lowest converted mana cost revealed this way.  Draw cards equal to the highest converted mana cost revealed this way.

first off, I love the card.  A little wordy, but great idea.  Please keep us updated if you come up with new wording.

I finally got a new and improved proxy printing method: 




yes i misspelled permanent.  i also still haven't found out if we are going to go to have 3 islands tap for mana or not.  This was more trying to prove out my new method.
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« Reply #34 on: October 23, 2008, 08:45:21 PM »

I feel that 17 Loyalty counter is a little too much. The turn it comes into play, it will most likely have 26 counters. Even if it uses it's ultimate ability, it will be at 8 counters with no other permanent on the table. If would be a lot easier to just kill the player controlling the planeswalker, and I think that is not really the point of a planeswalker.

It's see it more at 7 total with +3, -3 and -10. That way, if you do use its ultimate ability too soon, you lose the planeswalker.

Also, 17 + 9 seems a bitch to remember with counters and even with a classic D20.
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« Reply #35 on: October 23, 2008, 08:56:44 PM »

I feel that 17 Loyalty counter is a little too much. The turn it comes into play, it will most likely have 26 counters. Even if it uses it's ultimate ability, it will be at 8 counters with no other permanent on the table. If would be a lot easier to just kill the player controlling the planeswalker, and I think that is not really the point of a planeswalker.

It's see it more at 7 total with +3, -3 and -10. That way, if you do use its ultimate ability too soon, you lose the planeswalker.

Also, 17 + 9 seems a bitch to remember with counters and even with a classic D20.

good points.  problem with 7 starting, like Paul pointed out, is that your not likely to ever get the ultimate.  With 7 +3 -3 -10 even 1 damage keeps you off the ultimate, and its probably not worth playing if you're never going to hit the ultimate.  I'm not saying that my loyalty is better, just not sure where the balance between too high and too low is.
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« Reply #36 on: October 23, 2008, 10:55:30 PM »

Prisoner's Dilemma
UUUURRRR
Sorcery
Choose any number of target opponents.  Each opponent chosen this way chooses and reveals a non-land card. The player who reveals the card with the lowest converted mana cost takes damage equal to highest converted mana cost revealed this way.  The player who reveals the card with the highest converted mana cost gains life equal to the lowest converted mana cost revealed this way.  Draw cards equal to the highest converted mana cost revealed this way.

One reason to have any number of opponents is so that if someone has a "cannot be targetted" effect (True Believer or w/e), you can still cast it. But that can be alleviated by just not having targets. Here's my attempt:

Prisoner's Dilemma
UUUURRRR
Instant
Each opponent chooses a card from their hand and reveals it. If they do, the players who revealed the card with the highest converted mana cost gains life equal to the lowest converted mana cost revealed this way. The players that revealed the card with the lowest converted mana cost loses an amount of life equal to the highest converted mana cost revealed this way, then draw that many cards.

First, you don't have to make any stipulations on how the cards are revealed: the rules take care of that. Each person makes their choice at the same time, and then they are revealed in APNAP order, though it's one simultaneous action. The easiest way to do this is to place them face-down, but it doesn't actually designate the process for doing this. It's similar to deciding how to handle random discard: the effect is in the rules, but the process for determining how to accomplish it isn't laid out.

Next, I think the "If they do" clause could be effective here, but I'm not certain if I used it correctly. In my wording, if someone has an empty hand, and thus does not reveal, does the entire effect do nothing, or does it just not do anything for that player?

I pluralized players to account for tie situations.

I had to remove the "non-land" clause, because with it, players can just say that every card is a land, and since it uses a private zone, there is no way to disprove that. It is mostly irrelevant in T4, but makes the card a lot worse if it were in "real" Magic.

Finally, I merged the last two lines. I'm pretty sure that works, but if it doesn't, or makes it overly complicated, you can just re-separate them. It was just an attempt to shave a few words off a lengthy text box.

As far as the card itself though, I'm not sure how much tension there actually is. It's almost always correct to reveal as low as you possibly can, because the incentive for revealing high is basically just an irrelevant amount of life and a mediocre amount of damage to a random opponent, for the cost of having another opponent draw a ton of cards. It's still a solid card for the caster though, as it will probably draw an average of about 3-4 cards in T4, while shifting life totals an irrelevant amount. I'd look at it similarly to Prophetic Bolt.
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« Reply #37 on: October 24, 2008, 02:58:59 PM »

final version, for now.  at least it would be if i would learn to check these things before i print them.

« Last Edit: October 24, 2008, 03:36:00 PM by kuberr » Logged
thorme
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« Reply #38 on: October 24, 2008, 03:49:27 PM »

Here's my attempt:

Prisoner's Dilemma
UUUURRRR
Instant
Each opponent chooses a card from their hand and reveals it. If they do, the players who revealed the card with the highest converted mana cost gains life equal to the lowest converted mana cost revealed this way. The players that revealed the card with the lowest converted mana cost loses an amount of life equal to the highest converted mana cost revealed this way, then draw that many cards.

...

Finally, I merged the last two lines. I'm pretty sure that works, but if it doesn't, or makes it overly complicated, you can just re-separate them. It was just an attempt to shave a few words off a lengthy text box.

As far as the card itself though, I'm not sure how much tension there actually is. It's almost always correct to reveal as low as you possibly can, because the incentive for revealing high is basically just an irrelevant amount of life and a mediocre amount of damage to a random opponent, for the cost of having another opponent draw a ton of cards. It's still a solid card for the caster though, as it will probably draw an average of about 3-4 cards in T4, while shifting life totals an irrelevant amount. I'd look at it similarly to Prophetic Bolt.

You can't merge the last two lines.  It's the caster that draws the cards equal to the highest revealed, not the players who reveal the lowest.  This is not clear with your wording.

I think revealing low has a not-totally-insignificant downside considering you risk getting hit for a fairly large amount of damage...at least given some of the casting costs in our stack (not to mention should someone have Gleemax in hand).
« Last Edit: October 24, 2008, 03:53:13 PM by thorme » Logged

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« Reply #39 on: October 25, 2008, 05:16:26 AM »

Heh, yeah Gleemax would be pretty sick, kill the caster and the person that revealed the lowest.

Also, technically my wording does give the cards to the caster, but I agree that it is confusing. It says "...then draw that many cards," which is an action that would be taken by the caster. If it said "...then draws that many cards, it would refer to the last mentioned player, which in this case would be the person that revealed the lowest. Silly verb conjugation. But yeah, I agree that splicing the two lines adds more complexity than saving a few words is worth.
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« Reply #40 on: October 25, 2008, 10:22:28 AM »

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thorme
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« Reply #41 on: October 25, 2008, 10:37:47 AM »

Sweet.  Very nice kuberr!
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« Reply #42 on: October 25, 2008, 02:28:30 PM »

yeah, much better.  I liked the concept a lot, so i felt like it would be a good idea to get some better templating.  I would make some really minor tweaks, but I think it's really good.

I'd do it like this:

Each opponent chooses a card from his or her hand and reveals it simultaneously.

The player(s) who revealed the card with the highest CMC gains life equal to the lowest CMC revealed this way.

The player(s) that revealed the card with the lowest CMC loses an amount of life equal to the highest CMC revealed this way.

Draw cards equal to the highest CMC revealed this way.



Is that art from the Magic computer game?

I like the final version of White Queen, too Smile  Much more playable.  The last thing you want is to make mediocre home-made cards.  that thing has some power now.
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« Reply #43 on: October 25, 2008, 03:22:50 PM »

Is that art from the Magic computer game?

It's from Portal/8th Edition Balance of Power.
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« Reply #44 on: October 25, 2008, 09:55:28 PM »

What about:
"the player who reveals the lowest CMC loses life equal to the highest CMC. and remove the card they revealed from the game.
the player who revealed the highest CMC may play the that was removed without paying its mana cost until end of turn, and as though it had Flash.
draw cards equal to the highest CMC revealed."
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« Reply #45 on: October 26, 2008, 12:27:51 PM »

This could be interesting for T4:

Master of His Domain
Land
{5}, {T}, sacrifice ~this~: Choose one basic land you own of each basic land type from outside the game, and put those cards into play.

If you play with the "pay for it = doesn't count for your spell for the turn" rule, this could be strong; otherwise, it's somewhat weak, but still not useless. It also powers up various all kinds of stuff.

I added the {5} so it would be balanced for non-T4 play.
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« Reply #46 on: November 23, 2008, 03:20:38 AM »

Sorry for the necro guys, but I noticed there was a thread like this a while ago, only all the pictures of those custom cards are all gone. If anyone still has the cards from that thread, could they please post them here?

Here's the url:

http://www.themanadrain.com/index.php?topic=21889.0
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« Reply #47 on: February 26, 2009, 03:46:18 PM »

Hey, I've just started playing Type 4 and decided to proxy up some of the custom cards I saw on this site as well as add my own to the mix.

If anyone can post any other new cards they've seen I'd love to see them to get ideas!

Edited because picasa was not meant to share linked photos Smile

Here is the card I came up with for our group.


Here are the other cards I've seen on the mana drain.



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« Reply #48 on: July 15, 2009, 07:07:57 PM »

here are the cards that I made for my cube:

#1 - Glacious Flip Card

Side 1: Glacious the Planesglider 1UUU

Artifact Planeswalker - Glacius

Flash, flip Glacius when he runs out of Loyalty counters.

+10: Gain control of target permanent.
-30: Counter target spell. (You may use this ability as an instant)
-60: Ignore the one spell per turn rule for the rest of the game.

40 Loyalty

Side 2: Glacious, Vedalken Conquerer

Artifact Creature - Vedalken Dreadnought

Shroud, Unblockable

Counter the first spell an opponent plays each turn.

20/20


#2 - Chance//Purpose Split Card

Chance 1UBR

Instant

Flip a coin. If you win the flip each opponent discard their hands and you gain control of all permanents. If you lose the flip discard your hand and sacrifice all of your permanents.

//

Purpose 1GWU

Instant

If every other player has cast a spell this turn draw 7 cards and gain 1 million life. If not, you may put as many creatures from your hand into play until the end of turn.
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« Reply #49 on: September 10, 2009, 03:24:31 PM »

Ever since Vs. System went under (R.I.P.) I've been itching to make some custom cards, and I've found that T4 would be perfect (As it's a casual bomb-y format after all)

If you know anything about Vs. System you'll know that some effects are much stronger there than in Magic. As in, tapping a creature when it isn't your turn is HUGE in Vs. and not really a big deal in Magic. Destroying resources (Land is the best comparison I guess) without replacing them is also very rare. +DEF abilities are also much more critical in Vs. You also can't convert cost and P/T directly or you'd have 7 mana 16/16's that steal turns with no drawbacks.

Anyway, these are loosely inspired by their Vs. System counterparts. I'm still experimenting. They're not that hugely overpowered or swingy like some of the cards posted before me, but here's my attempt nonetheless:



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« Reply #50 on: September 10, 2009, 08:16:41 PM »

Those are pretty cool - I would recommend that the named dudes should be legendary, though.
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« Reply #51 on: September 10, 2009, 08:49:35 PM »

Don't really understand the need for Prof X's second ability? Why would you pay life, it seems only useful in very limited situations, you could replace that with something different in flavor.

Also, 2/2? He's in a WHEELCHAIR! You're telling me he can take a bear in combat? I'd make him 0/2, that chair can probably take 1 damage for him.

Enemy seems a little weak, take Eladamri's Call for instance, or even Chord of Calling. Both are far superior, at least make the creature come into play, althought it would need to be some other color then.

One more thing, Batman black and Red? Since when is he greedy and anarchic?

I'd also probably remove the "from their hand" part of Dr. Doom, it adds very little and I don't see why other spells would be allowed.

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« Reply #52 on: September 11, 2009, 08:46:05 AM »

Don't really understand the need for Prof X's second ability? Why would you pay life, it seems only useful in very limited situations, you could replace that with something different in flavor.

Also, 2/2? He's in a WHEELCHAIR! You're telling me he can take a bear in combat? I'd make him 0/2, that chair can probably take 1 damage for him.

Enemy seems a little weak, take Eladamri's Call for instance, or even Chord of Calling. Both are far superior, at least make the creature come into play, althought it would need to be some other color then.

One more thing, Batman black and Red? Since when is he greedy and anarchic?

I'd also probably remove the "from their hand" part of Dr. Doom, it adds very little and I don't see why other spells would be allowed.



Yeah, I see what you mean. Batman should probably be mono-red or R/W. I also agree with Professor X's P/T as 0/2. The 2 life is to steal the creature permanently, but in T4 you can just use his first ability every turn so it doesn't matter. (Although your opponent does regain control temporarily every turn for what it's worth) I'll probably just end up making the second ability cost mana as well, but more of it.

Enemy of my Enemy and to an extent Dr. Doom are both the way they are as a side effect of me trying to tie it too closely to the actual Vs. System card. EomE for example is nearly identical except in Vs. the effect in general is WAY stronger, it was a $50 card at that point. Dr. Doom's "From the hand" is the same scenario.

Here's the original for reference.


In hindsight, I would probably change it to something a little more powerful such as:
"When Dr. Doom enters the battlefield, return target instant or sorcery card from your graveyard to your hand.
As long as Dr. Doom is untapped, your opponents can't cast non-creature spells."

EomE would be something like:
"As an additional cost to play Enemy of my Enemy, discard a creature card.
Search your library for a creature card that doesn't share a creature type with the discarded card an put it into play. Shuffle your library afterwards."
Then change it to a sorcery, then make it G/B or just green.
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« Reply #53 on: September 12, 2009, 07:56:05 AM »

Quote
Yeah, I see what you mean. Batman should probably be mono-red or R/W. I also agree with Professor X's P/T as 0/2.

I still don't get why Batman would be mono-red. He is all but red, he fights for Law and Protection. I would make him black and white. He is a hero, with a dark side. He's the DARK knight after all, not the Angry Impulsive knight.

Quote
The 2 life is to steal the creature permanently, but in T4 you can just use his first ability every turn so it doesn't matter. (Although your opponent does regain control temporarily every turn for what it's worth) I'll probably just end up making the second ability cost mana as well, but more of it.

With infinite mana as in T4, I don't see the point of this, you would then only use his second ability and never the first.
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« Reply #54 on: October 04, 2009, 10:02:56 AM »

Batman should probably be White and Black

Proff. X seems blue

Red for superman?...
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« Reply #55 on: October 14, 2009, 11:51:45 AM »

Batman should probably be White and Black

Proff. X seems blue

Red for superman?...

Superman is a mono-white creature. Truth, justice, and the American way!
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