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Single-Card Discussion

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  [GRN] Molderhulk
  • BlindTherapy

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  @sfielder001 to the degree that i think it's playable, it's as a maindeck card functioning as a dread return target that can also be hardcast, although its hardcast may be worse than things solely dedicated to that role.

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  [GOR] Mnemonic Betrayal
  • MaximumCDawg

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  Seems very strong with Mindtwist, or Thoughtsieze/Hymn affects. Could a mill variant based around this card as a 4 of become a thing?

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  [GRN] Experimental Frenzy
  • fsecco

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  @serracollector said in [GRN] Experimental Frenzy:

  Assuming they have red Mana?

  A deck with LoA and without red mana? I thought most blue decks in Vintage packed Volcanics and/or 3-4 Opal + Ruby/Lotus/Petal. Is the plan to spend 2 cards to give this to them and hope they won't draw their 5-11 red sources, specially when Frenzy and LoA help them?

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  [GOR] Discovery // Dispersal
  • Protoaddct

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  Dredge would likely never cast the second half so mental note and thought scour seem like better options, if only because dredge with mana tends to be rainbow.

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  [GOR] Thousand-Year Storm
  • Tittliewinks22

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  And would just need 4 bolts as the finisher.

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  [GOR] Ral, Izzet Viceroy
  • moorebrother1

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  @fsecco Blue Moon already does well against Shops when I last played it. I had issues with Jeskai and issues with Dredge. This guy may help with Jeskai (he does get Pyroblasted) but does nothing against Dredge.

  I like his presence over Sphinx which always just got removed when I played him. If the Sphinx stayed I won in a turn. This guy has a better chance to still and still ends the game in 2 turns with card draw then ultimate 2 turns later to end the game. He does more than Chandra and Teferi for Blue/Red, not sure if he helps as much as Jace.

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  [GOR] Creeping Chill
  • Oestrus

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  @fsecco Bless their hearts.

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  [GRN] Assassin's Trophy
  • revengeanceful

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  @claasch Seems reasonable to adjust if that's the case.

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  [GOR] Goblin Cratermaker
  • John Cox

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  @Brass-Man I think that's a really good point. Now that I look at this card I think its a bit too much of a compromise to be worth running in any one situation.

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  lotleth giant
  • babau

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  from my test is only a new possible alternative

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  lasav, the multifarious
  • babau

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  @thecravenone Iam not sure if you are just mocking the fringe format or if you are actually interested.
  It's a UB deck with rituals, petal, LED, a ton of cantrips, tutors like personal, mystical, merchant scroll and stuff like lim duls vault. For protection i have some cheap countermagic, discard (inquisition is obviously insane) and few removal.
  It's all about finding Doomsday and either go the easy route: TOP Predict, Labman, unearth, BS, - BOT. Which is cheap and easy to pull off but can be disrupted by removal.
  Or go for: TOP Ideas Unbound, Remand, Brain Freeze, -, - BOT
  This storm kill is usually very hard to disrupt, but costs a ton of mana and you can't to be able to kill the same turn as casting Doomsday.
  Of course all of those can be modified and the usual doomsday stuff. Sadly a lot of great cards like black tutors, yawgwill, Necrosis, fast mana etc. are banned.
  It's really fun though I love when I get to play.

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  [GOR] Mission Briefing
  • Tittliewinks22

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  How does this compare to ponder? I think that is more relevant than snapcaster mage. Also, this would be great in Oath!

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  [GOR] Izoni, Thousand-Eyed
  • Protoaddct

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  @vaughnbros I just wanted to call that out as exactly the correct response to this kind of spoiler.

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  [GOR] Niv-Mizzet, Parun
  • evouga

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  Time to dust off my city of brass and put them back in a blue deck with Big-Niv in it.

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  [GOR] Basics
  • John Cox

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  Well, I like 'em, esp. the Swamp and Forest.

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  [GOR] Thought Erasure
  • Protoaddct

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  We found the Anticipate of discard effects.

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  [GOR} Quasiduplicate
  • John Cox

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  Hmm, are there Oath creatures that win the game on the spot in duplicate? Yosei probably does in most board states (keep cloning/Oathing copies to take indefinite virtual extra turns) and is hard-castable. Are there other back-breaking leaves-play or enters-play effects? Or taking another angle, what's the best hasty evasive creature these days?

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  [C18] Retrofitter Foundry
  • krikt

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  So I've been screwing around with this thing casually, and it's really fun. Not sure it's vintage-level power, naturally. But, it can be tutored out and then it gives you a useful mana sink turn after turn. If you get Sai, Master Thopterist going with it or happen to be running other Thopters, it gets really powerful.

  The deck I stuck it in has Ornithopters, Roterothopter, and Pilgrim's Eye. They're all pretty terrible, but Goblin Welder at least makes Eye sort of workable.

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  [C18] Yuriko, The Tiger's Shadow
  • Protoaddct

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  I think to truly evaluate this card you really have to look at the entire class of Ophidians, and psuedo-Ophidians. We have a ton of versions of that card now. Just to name some of the ones that I remember seeing people play in Vintage at one point or another:
  Finkel (Shadowmage Infiltrator)
  Ninja of the Deep Hours
  Cold-Eyed Selkie
  Augury Adept
  Dimir Cutpurse
  Ohran Viper
  Edric, Spymaster of Trest
  Prophetic Flamespeeker

  Psuedo's:
  Dark Confidant
  Azra Oddsmaker (ok this one is new too!)
  Pain Seer
  Baleful Strix w/ Welder
  Curiosity
  Sword of Fire and Ice
  Asylum Visitor (I was really high on this card)

  Reverse Ophidian:
  Hypnotic Specter and friends

  Now despite this list being very long and not even complete, I dont think any of these cards are seeing play right now. That isnt to say that this card isnt playable, but it is to say that this card has to succeed in an area fairly saturated in with good cards that arent seeing play.

  What it does better it seems is that it is a better clock than most of these other cards. It's also on the higher side of synergy with other creatures along with Edric, Ninja, and the new Azra Oddsmaker. Its also blue so it pitches to Force. So it certainly has a number of benefits that if you can leverage then it can be a better option than others.

  What it does worse than others is getting through blockers, and it needs to attack unlike Bob, Strix, Visitor. Unlike Finkel or Selkie, it doesnt have evasion. Unlike Ohran Viper or Flamespeaker, it doesnt have a mechanic to punish blockers. So I think certainly it needs more help in order to trigger compared to these cards.

  So where are we at in terms of a deck to maximize this card?
  Plays Force of Will.
  Plays Snapcaster, Clique, Trinket Mage and/or other creatures with CiP effects.
  Plays enough high CC spells / Sensei's top to maximize damage.
  Plays enough remove /pump spells to get it through blockers

  It sounds awful close to wanting to be in an Outcome deck, except for the last part of needing cards to clear its path.

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  PSA: Containment Priest isn’t good
  • wfain

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  @wfain Apology accepted. Sorry for derailing the thread.